Interview with Dictator: ‘It unlocked the sound we were looking for’

West Lothian, Scottish band, Dictator, is riding high on the success of their recent anthemic single, ‘Hide and Seek’, with three new singles in the works.

The band comprises Michael Campbell (vocals, keyboard, guitar), Zach Tarimo Goodhur (guitar), Joe Murty (bass) and Allan Ramsay (drums/percussion). Campbell and Murty have known each other since primary school and Tarimo Goodhur and Ramsay go back to secondary school. ‘Me and Joe were in a band before and they were in a band before and, as fate would have it, we went for a wee jam in 2019 and ended up starting this band,’ Campbell said. Their name is partly a reference to the fact that Campbell, in his words, ‘runs a right ship by writing all the songs’. ‘We play quotes from the Charlie Chaplin film, The Great Dictator at our live shows but Zach thought I was a control freak and said I’m a bit of a dictator, can’t disagree, haha!,’ he said.

Last month, they released ‘Hide and Seek’, a beautiful and mesmerising track about a break-up and from which all digital download proceeds are being donated to Women’s Aid, a grassroots organisation in the UK trying to combat domestic violence. In the track, Campbell’s vocals soar in waves, as the dreamy soundscapes dip and swell with deliberate intensity.

‘It’s not about one person,’ Campbell said. ‘It’s more imagined, you think of certain scenarios. I’m engaged, we’ve been together for 10 years. It’s so strange, it’s a break-up song imagining how the break-up would feel, that outpouring of emotions you feel.’

‘The more people we work with, the more our songwriting changes’

Interestingly, it was actually the first song that Campbell wrote, and the six-minute long track really gives his voice a chance to shine. It would be the perfect song to end a set with. ‘I was in between jobs, over in Spain all by myself when I wrote it, it probably wasn’t ideal,’ he joked. ‘The reason it’s so long is that the more people we work with, the more our songwriting changes as does the song length. Pink Floyd are one of my main influences, some of their songs are 14-15 minutes, I wanted it to be that length!’

The chorus sounds fittingly anguished: ‘Hide and seek, you said you loved me once, now I’m obsolete. This ain’t hide and seek, it ain’t some game that we can beat.’

However, people in the industry advised them to cut it down to a more radio play friendly length: ‘We couldn’t cut it, we tried but it didn’t make sense for the song,’ Campbell said. He describes the song as being the ‘polar opposite’ of their previous track, ‘Moonlight’, which also came out this year: ”Hide and Seek’ and ‘Moonlight’ were supposed to be a double A side in February but we couldn’t get it made,’ Campbell said. ”Moonlight’ is as close to a love song as you have, it’s about the good side of loving someone, it’s more ballady than ‘Hide and Seek’. With ‘Moonlight’, we wanted it to be intimate, it feels like it’s just me and the room. I actually wrote it because our drummer was on paternity and I thought it would be a good pared back one when he couldn’t play.’

The lyrics attest to that: ‘I danced with the moon last night, under the haze of his light. Intoxicated we done as lovers do, we dreamed of love and I dreamed of you.’

‘I’ve realised playing bass that less is more’

They wrote their debut single, ‘Anthem for a Doomed Youth’, shortly before they recorded it in 2019, according to Murty. ‘We were sitting on three songs and we decided to release it first,’ he said. ‘We knew what we had coming up. We were talking about it the other day. It’s a journey, isn’t it?’

I ask Campbell if the track was inspired by the Wilfred Owen poem of the same name: ‘It was, yes! He’s my favourite poet. Just through sheer coincidence, we learned about Dulce et Decorum Est (another poem by Owens describing the horrors of war) at school and it really resonated with me.’

‘Anthem for a Doomed Youth’ could not be more unlike ‘Hide and Seek’, it’s more raucous, synthy and poppier, so much so that it could almost be from a different band and I tell them this: ‘That’s conscious, I know it can sound arsey but we don’t want to be defined by a genre,’ Campbell said. ‘We don’t want to say we’re an indie band, we’ve got very different musical tastes. Zach is ultra hip hop but he also likes Jimi Hendrix and Eddie Van Halen.’ Murty nods: ‘It’s a bit mental, I like a bit of everything. I’ve realised playing bass that less is more. You can bring so much with synthesizers.’ ‘You like 60’s stuff, Joe,’ Campbell interjects: ‘Man, aye, I love The Kinks and psychedelic stuff,’ Murty said. Campbell has other influences: ‘I like bands like Gorillaz, Arctic Monkeys and Kasabian,’ he said. ‘It’s not always the same style of sound. Some people double down on their sound but we want to consciously say that’s a cop out (laughs).’

‘We’re more synth-based, we’re not afraid to add in samples’

Subsequently, their next single will bring us something new again: ‘It’s more upbeat, catchier, a lot more poppy,’ Murty said. Campbell joins it: ‘It’s weirder, it’s got a good bass line!,’ he laughed. ‘I don’t play the guitar as much anymore, just the keys, that came out of lockdown. As a result, we’re more synth-based, we’re not afraid to add in samples. We’re buzzing!’ They have two-or-three songs that they can release next. ‘We’re constantly recording and writing,’ Campbell said. ‘It’s essentially about trying to pick the right one. We’re fine tuning the next ones and it depends on production. We’re not settled on our next one yet.’

However, they’re working towards an EP that will come out this year or next year. They’re keeping it under wraps for now but say that the title track of the EP is their favourite of their songs to date: ‘It’s the one song we’ve wanted for the last 18 months, it unlocked the sound we were looking for,’ Campbell said. ‘It’s the favourite of all of us. We love it but you have to stop listening to it so you don’t get bored of it. On release day, that’s the next time you listen to it, it sounds fresh again and you remember why you loved it so much.’

They got to play three or four proper shows before lockdown, including a gig with Mark Sharp & the Bicycle Thieves in Newcastle: ‘They asked us to Lewis Capaldi’s after party, it was the last gig we saw before lockdown. We said to each other, right, we won’t get drunk, we’ll get back nice and early but straight away we had two pints and when we went to pay for them, we were told they were free. We looked at each other and that’s when it descended into chaos!,’ Campbell laughed. ‘We got back so late, I got to my desk at work at 09:15, I had to be there for 09:30 but I was still wearing my clothes from the night before!’

They typically open a set with ‘Days Gone By’, which came out last year: ‘There’s a speech from The Great Dictator, the Charlie Chaplin film, we’ve diced it up and that’s our entrance as a band,’ Campbell said. ‘We’ve gone on a break and I’ve played ‘Moonlight’ just by myself and then ‘Hide and Seek’ is the perfect song to follow, it ramps it up.’

‘The song’s an anti-drug song and about someone clinging onto something they shouldn’t’

I tell them that ‘Days Gone By’ has the whiff of a Bond theme about it, it has that kind of energy and Campbell grins: ‘I hope that means we’ve nailed down a Bond theme at some point! I wrote it a long time ago, we chucked in the synth at the start and the stubbier bass. It progressed to beefing up the chorus with the synths all layered up. The song’s an anti-drug song and about someone clinging onto something they shouldn’t.’

With a strong focus on collaboration and an outspoken social conscience, they are vocal supporters of their local scene. Inspirations are worn on their sleeves with clear nods to Gorillaz, Primal Scream, Alt-J and London Grammar. If they could collaborate with anyone, they say they’d love to work with American rapper, Nas: ‘That’d be the dream, it would add a different element to it,’ Campbell said. Murty agrees: ‘Lyrically, he’s amazing.’ I ask if they’d consider writing a rap or hip hop song: ‘Genuinely, if it’s all going well, we would 100% do a rap/hip hop one,’ Campbell said. ‘Hip hop is the crux of what we do, it’s where 99% of our songs start off from. It’s that hip hop era beat, people like J Dilla and the beat machines he uses showed us a way to craft songs. Our challenge is to try and slot some melodies and vocals over the top! But it’s that main groove from hip hop that inspires us.’

Locally, they are huge fans of The Snuts, with whom they have shared the stage: ‘We beat them at FIFA,’ Campbell laughed. ‘Can you make sure that makes it in?!’ Murty is laughing: ‘In West Lothian, they played a lot of the same venues as us. We played a gig in Bathgate and we were short of an amp and they let us use one of theirs. You support locally. They’ve been the same, genuinely, for the last five or six years. They used to rehearse at the same place as us and you could turn up at any time and they’d be practicing.’

We chat for a bit about the great bands who’ve come out of West Lothian: ‘I know, there shouldn’t be all these bands coming out of here but there are,’ said Campbell, sounding genuinely amazed. ‘There’s Lewis Capaldi, The Snuts, Mark Sharp & the Bicycle Thieves, there’s a real plethora of bands. There must be something in the water!’

(Photo from left to right: Michael, Allan, Zach and Joe.)